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Former President Donald Trump, the 2024 Republican presidential candidate, points at a supporters July 24, 2024, campaign rally in Charlotte, N.C. (AP)
As a U.S. senator in 2018, Kamala Harris criticized the Trump administration’s immigration policies, including a policy that led to family separations at the border.
In that context, Harris said U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement’s function should be reexamined and that "we need to probably even think about starting from scratch."
But Harris didn’t say there shouldn’t be immigration enforcement. In 2018, Harris also said U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement had a role and should exist.
In a flurry of attacks against his likely 2024 presidential opponent, former President Donald Trump said Vice President Kamala Harris allowed millions of immigrants to illegally "stampede" across the border and supported eliminating a central immigration enforcement agency.
"Lyin’ Kamala supported abolishing ICE," Trump said July 24 at a Charlotte, North Carolina, campaign rally.
Trump, who pilloried several parts of Harris’ record, was referring to Immigration and Customs Enforcement, the agency in charge of detaining and deporting immigrants who are illegally in the United States.
In spring 2018, the "abolish ICE" movement drew attention after Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez of New York won her House primary and said it was "time to abolish" the agency. A small number of Democratic lawmakers or candidates supported the "abolish ICE" movement as a protest against Trump policies. Congress never abolished Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
The Trump and Harris campaigns responded to our query about Trump’s rally claim with multiple citations of Harris statements; we found many more through our own research. There is no record of Harris saying she would "abolish ICE," a specific phrase that others like Ocasio-Cortez have used. And in 2019, when asked point-blank if she supports abolishing the Department of Homeland Security, which oversees Immigration and Customs Enforcement, Harris said no.
Trump campaign spokesperson Steven Cheung told PolitiFact that Harris "ran on a platform dedicated to defunding the police and abolishing ICE, and there is no question that she will implement these horrible policies if she has the chance."
Harris, as a California senator, criticized the Trump administration’s immigration policies, including a deterrence policy that led to the separation of children and parents who arrived at the border illegally.
In a March 2018 MSNBC interview, Harris said Immigration and Customs Enforcement should exist to deport people who commit serious and violent crimes, including rape, murder and child molestation.
"So, yes, ICE has a purpose. ICE has a role, ICE should exist," Harris said. "But let’s not abuse the power. Let’s not extend it to areas that were not — that are not posing a threat to the safety and the public safety of these communities, especially when we know that these federal agencies have limited resources to do their core job."
The Trump campaign pointed to a June 2018 MSNBC interview in which host Kasie Hunt asked Harris whether she agreed with the calls to abolish Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
Harris: "Listen, I think there is no question that we’ve got to critically reexamine ICE and its role and the way it is being administered and the work it is doing. And we need to probably even think about starting from scratch because there’s a lot that is wrong with the way that it is conducting itself and we need to deal with that."
Hunt: "What do you think should be the alternative to ICE?"
Harris: "Well, first of all, I don't think that the government should be in the position of separating families and that is clearly what is part of what's happening at ICE and DHS. You look at what’s happening again in terms of how they are conducting their perspective on asylum seekers. That is a real problem and is contrary to all the spirit and the reason we even have the asylum rules and laws in the first place. So, their mission I think is very much in question and has to be reexamined."
On ABC’s "The View" in 2019, Harris was asked whether she would abolish the Department of Homeland Security, which includes Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
"No, I would not," Harris said. She called the department "dysfunctional" and said the government needs to "fix it, but I do not believe in getting rid of it."
The Trump campaign also pointed to other Harris statements that were critical of Trump’s immigration enforcement policies, but none of the comments go as far as Trump claimed in his remarks.
In 2019, Harris called raids on workplaces the Trump administration’s "campaign of terror" that she said would make immigrants afraid to go to work. Harris co-sponsored legislation to block Immigration and Customs Enforcement arrests at schools, hospitals, and religious institutions without prior approval and exigent circumstances.
The Washington Post in 2020 reported that Harris was among the politicians who wanted to restructure the agency, but not abolish it. NPR reached similar conclusions in 2018.
The Trump campaign also pointed to a 2008 New York Times article written when Harris was San Francisco district attorney. But this article does not address Harris’ stance on Immigration and Customs Enforcement’s existence; it said San Francisco was assuring immigrants who were in the country illegally that the city would not report them to federal immigration authorities. In the article, Harris said criminals tend to tell their victims who are in the country illegally that they will be treated as criminals because of their immigration status.
Harris’ 2019 presidential primary immigration platform did not call for abolishing Immigration and Customs Enforcement. She called to overhaul immigration enforcement policies and focus enforcement on increasing public safety. The Biden-Harris ticket’s 2020 campaign platform also did not call for abolishing the agency.
In February 2024, Harris backed bipartisan legislation that included border enforcement. The bill sought to limit the number of asylum seekers and included funding for Immigration and Customs Enforcement to increase detention capacity and removal flights and hire more personnel.
That proposal died amid Republican opposition.
Trump said Harris "supported abolishing ICE."
It’s clear that Harris opposed, and opposes, many of Trump’s immigration positions. And she called for an end to the hard-line tactics that had been used by the administration.
But she never said she would abolish Immigration and Customs Enforcement. In fact, she said the opposite.
We rate Trump’s statement False.
RELATED: Fact-checking Donald Trump’s rally in Charlotte, N.C.
C-SPAN, former President Donald Trump rally in Charlotte, July 24, 2024
C-SPAN, J.D. Vance rally in Virginia, July 22, 2024
Congress.gov, H.R.6361 - Establishing a Humane Immigration Enforcement System Act, 2018
MSNBC, All in with Chris Hayes, March 7, 2018
YouTube, Sen. Kamala Harris: We Must "Reexamine ICE And Its Role" | Kasie DC | MSNBC, June 2018
Fox News, Kamala Harris is for defunding the police, abolishing ICE: Julie Hamill, July 23, 2024
Washington Post, Would you redistribute the responsibilities of Immigrations and Customs Enforcement (ICE) to other agencies? If so, would ICE be abolished? 2020
Politico, Harris once opposed the border closure. As vice president, she supports it. May 12, 2021
National Review, Kamala Harris Backs Publicly Funded Health Care for Illegal Immigrants, Aug. 11, 2020
Politico, Kamala Harris: Immigration raids will distort 2020 census, Aug. 11, 2020
Sen. Kamala Harris, Harris, Colleagues Introduce Bill to Block Immigration Raids at Schools, Hospitals, Courthouses and Churches, July 11, 2019
Congress.gov, H.R.1011 - Protecting Sensitive Locations Act, 2019
Trump campaign, X post, Sept. 22, 2020
Rev.com, Kamala Harris ‘Shop Talk’ Campaign Visit Detroit, Michigan Transcript, Sept. 22, 2020
CNN, Mandela Barnes has signaled support for removing police funding and abolishing ICE – despite ad claiming otherwise, Oct. 7, 2022
CNN This morning, Transcript, July 24, 2024
The Daily Beast, Kamala Harris Joins Fellow Democrats in Calling for Re-examining ICE; Senator Kamala Harris, perhaps the most high-profile Democrat to do so, said that the enforcement system needs to change, June 24, 2018
San Francisco Chronicle, Kamala Harris out front on new litmus test for Dems: What to do about ICE? June 28, 2018
Kamala Harris campaign, Immigration, 2019
Joe Biden campaign, Immigration, 2020
The Washington Post, "Trump and allies struggle to find a focused attack on Harris," Aug. 12, 2020
YouTube video from "Good Morning America," June 9, 2020
YouTube video from "The View," June 8, 2020
YouTube video from "Watch What Happens Live," June 25, 2020
Factcheck.org, Calls to Abolish ICE Not ‘Open Borders’ July 3, 2018
Factcheck.org, FactChecking Vance’s Attacks on Harris, July 25, 2024
New York Times, What Is ICE and Why Do Critics Want to Abolish It? July 3, 2018
NPR, 4 Questions About The Call To Abolish ICE, July 3, 2018
ABC News, The View, July 12, 2019
PolitiFact, "Fact-checking the 2020 vice presidential debate, Kamala Harris vs. Mike Pence," Oct. 8, 2020
PolitiFact, Pants On Fire: White House claim Sen. Kamala Harris ‘supporting MS-13’, July 3, 2018
PolitiFact, Website claims Democrats plan to abolish ICE if they win 2020 election, March 15, 2018
Trump campaign, Statement to PolitiFact, July 23, 2024
Harris campaign, Statement to PolitiFact, July 23, 2024
Email interview, Steven Cheung, Trump campaign spokesperson, July 25, 2024
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